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Offline bowtieboy

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clearances from a external instantaneous water heater
« on: September 10, 2012, 09:13:22 PM »
Hi all, this is my first post  :D
i have read a lot of your posts and found them very informative :)
My question is what is the clearance from a power flued instantaneous external water heater,ie rinnai/bosch/rheem 
to a regulator vent?

regards

Linkback: https://www.plumbers.nz/instantaneous-water-heaters/67/clearances-from-a-external-instantaneous-water-heater/1238/
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Offline Thunderhead

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Re: clearances from a external instantaneous water heater
« Reply #1 on: September 10, 2012, 10:08:39 PM »
CLEARANCE TO WHAT?
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Offline bowtieboy

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Re: clearances from a external instantaneous water heater
« Reply #2 on: September 11, 2012, 07:23:45 AM »
The required distance between a gas regulator vent and a instantaneous water heater.
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Offline gordyplum

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Re: clearances from a external instantaneous water heater
« Reply #3 on: September 11, 2012, 10:05:04 AM »
NZS5261 table16[a] should tell you all you need to know. I doubt it has changed with the new regs. It covers minimum clearances and is quite clear. ;)
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Offline bowtieboy

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Re: clearances from a external instantaneous water heater
« Reply #4 on: September 11, 2012, 07:37:24 PM »
hi gordyplum, yes table 16 shows clearances from a flue terminal to a meter service of  1 m ....but that does not answer my question...... and it certainly is not correct !!!...does any one else have a answer
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Offline 07442

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Re: clearances from a external instantaneous water heater
« Reply #5 on: September 11, 2012, 10:00:43 PM »
I believe the intention of 5621 in regards to clearance from a meter from an instantaneous water heater is, the flue terminal is considered a source of ignition, the majority of meters have vents on their regulators, which 'vent' under certain conditions...makes sense.
Me - I'd treat your regulator in the same way as a meter.
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Offline bowtieboy

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Re: clearances from a external instantaneous water heater
« Reply #6 on: September 12, 2012, 07:38:30 AM »
hi 07442, ok........anyone else ? there is a distanace.....what is it.
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Offline Thunderhead

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Re: clearances from a external instantaneous water heater
« Reply #7 on: September 12, 2012, 05:18:23 PM »
if you care to look closer at table 16 Ref d there is also(SEE 2.5.4.9 for vent terminal location of regulator!) it has clearances from a source of ignition ok so now look back too table 16 down to the notes section at bottom of table and see note 4 a flue terminal is considered to ba a source of ignitoion.......easy as pie  :P up to you to work out actual distances...is this what you ment???
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Offline Thunderhead

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Re: clearances from a external instantaneous water heater
« Reply #8 on: September 12, 2012, 05:23:18 PM »
the whole unit its self i would consider to be a source of ignition and should be placed outside the zone shown in 2.5.4.9 (b)...but what do i know im only a plumber...
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Offline 07442

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Re: clearances from a external instantaneous water heater
« Reply #9 on: September 12, 2012, 07:05:26 PM »
As far as distances from a regulator go. Put the reg against it if you want to. Just pipe the vent away from the unit, or change the reg to an opso (spelling?) - it doesn't vent. Just locks out.
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Offline bowtieboy

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Re: clearances from a external instantaneous water heater
« Reply #10 on: September 12, 2012, 07:35:06 PM »
hi thunderhead :) thank you for your thoughts.
 But yet i am to get a correct answer. you are right about 2.5.4.9.

i am asking this question because i have the correct answer after been audited by pgdb.  :(

i have my own understanding. yet pgdb say i am wrong, and i bet everyone out there doing gasfitting is too!
........the correct answer as pgdb say is 3 metres from a fan forced gas appliance to a gas regulator vent, regardless of it been a lpg or natural gas venting regulator!
they say gas appilances that draw air in mechancially come under 2.5.4.9 and must be 3 metres from a venting regulator!!
are you all aware? am i a dumb arse that has been doing my job wrong for the last 20 years?
i was at the boards lanch of nzs5261 2003... i read it the same way everyone in the room did....i have been audited 6 times yet this has never been raised!.
what do you all think?
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Offline 07442

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Re: clearances from a external instantaneous water heater
« Reply #11 on: September 12, 2012, 09:07:34 PM »
I'll have a closer look at my code tomorrow Again
I think the board is trying to justify their existence with some random bit of shit from the code that they themselves have probably just discovered.
I'll do a little 'test' tomorrow. The owner of the company I work for, amongst others had a big part in the writing of 5261, credited inside the cover along with a bunch of other industry heavy hitters.
I'll see what his answer is.
It does make sense though from a safety point of view.
I imagine there are thousands of non compliant installations out there, a few of them mine, now I've been made aware of this info.
P.s. f**** the pgdb - useless leeching rain of bastards that they are.

Thank you and have a nice day.
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Offline robbo

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Re: clearances from a external instantaneous water heater
« Reply #12 on: September 13, 2012, 01:19:53 PM »
hi guys, my reading of 2.5.4.9.and is the only reference to 3mtrs that i can find, and that is in the direction of discharge(straight out)and .500mm sideways so what is the problem,cheers
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Offline Jaxcat

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Re: clearances from a external instantaneous water heater
« Reply #13 on: September 13, 2012, 02:02:22 PM »
The other solution is to put a piece of PE (polytherm) pipe off the regulator vent and terminate it away.  That would make it compliant.  We agree that 2.5.4.9 Vent terminal location in 5261 is the one to use and it says under (a) Be at least 3m from a mechanical air inlet unless calculations based on figure 1 give a great distance....

Those with COC level 2A would have gone over this in their training. 

Might be a good source of an upskilling course and give the  chance for people to discuss their interpretations.
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Offline bowtieboy

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Re: clearances from a external instantaneous water heater
« Reply #14 on: September 13, 2012, 03:54:21 PM »
hi robbo, no 2.5.4.9 a doesnt say straight out, its in ALL directions... and yes it would be a good upskill jaxcat
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